I got a new bottle of Le Parfum de Therese and I'm worried: it smells different than the first bottles I've got. I have some jus left from the older one (purse spray) and some from a decant. The jasmine there is much more evident. The dry down of the new bottle just doesn't smell like my Therese... It smells like Citta di Kyoto (not a bad smell, but not Therese).

Has anyone else noticed a change or is it just me?

I really want to think I'm wrong but it doesn't smell right...

NO!!!!!!!!!

Please don't tell me that. I thought a range like the Malle's would be safe.

Maybe, your bottle needs to rest, if you received it by mail. I have found that shipping, especially in warm weather, affects the fragrance temporarily. I know this sounds silly, but it's happened to me several times. An order will arrive on a hot day and I'll open it, it smells aweful. I put it in a cupboard near the floor for a week. Go back, it's just dandy! The other possibility is that it has been reformulated. It's gonna be tricky for awhile for all fragrances that contained significant amounts of treemoss, oakmoss, birch tar, coumarin and the rest of the list. Tonya Sanchez mentioned in The Perfume Guide that perfumers are altering formula yearly right now. I think this is quite true because they are having to replace the irreplaceable, and it's not going very well. I mean, how on earth can they replace a huge glob of oakmoss with a tiny drop? Well, they have and we can smell the difference. My recent purchase of Private Collections was aweful, luckily I was able to exchange it for something else. You can't go by ingredients either, because there are allowances for changes without changing the print on the boxes. Date codes are your best bet, but of course, this doesn't help with Frederic Malle, I'm sure. I only have a miniset of these purchase when the Euro was cheap. I'm so sorry you are disappointed, especially for such an expensive purchase!

Well now you have me really intrigued with the comparison to Citta de Kyoto, since I thought that was an iris-heavy fragrance. Is LPdT an iris scent? I've always heard great things about it, but I never thought to try it since it sounds so feminine. Anyone think it could skew masculine?

Canel22,
Interesting observation re the heat during transit. But no, I bought it straight from the refrigerator at the Editions des Parfums in Holt Renfrew right here in Vancouver. So no, this possibility is ruled out. There is still the possibility that the juice I have left from 2 years back has changed and morphed in the bottle and this is the reason for the difference. But to be honest it just smells so different at the base that I don't think is the reason. I still have my doubts - because perception and how we remember fragrances is not always that accurate, which is why I've posted here. But the more I compare repeatedly I realize that there must be something there unfortunately.

As for ingredient lists: there is no oakmoss or tree moss listed on the packaging whatsoever, it reads: alcohol denat., parfum (fragrance), aqua (water), limonene, linalol, alpha-isomethyl ionone, eugenol, cinnamyl alcohol, benzyl bensoate, geraniol.
If there was oakmoss it would have be to be listed but it isn't (the ingredients that are listed are those that could cause allergy to some).

In any case, I don't recall the oakmoss being very dominant or strong in the bottle I had from 2 years ago. The difference I'm noticing is as if it has a lot less jasmine, or just a different jasmine altogether, and a completely different base: kind of cedary and woody and as I said it smells a lot like Citta di Kyoto's base - even though it still has that lusciously juicy astringent opening with the citrus and basil. After it settles what I get is instead of that very fresh cucumbery jasmine basil citrus and melon and plum - a very different synthetic wood (cedar?) smell. I just don't think the one from before was all that woody.

It sounds suspicious to me, for sure. I don't recall cedar either. I am sure that your older bottle has lost some topnotes a bit, they all do, so we can never expect an old bottle to smell just like a new one, but, the drydown should be the same. Jasmin does vary yearly even in Grasse, but often, perfumers once established, reformulate to cheaper jasmines from Egypt like Hermes did, or the ultimately cheapest jasmine, from Indian, like Samsara. Even Chanel, Inc reformulated #19 and #22 to use non-French Jasmine! As for the cedar, I find this rather odd. IT could be that it was there all along and other components changed making it more noticeable, or they just ramped it up. Just out of curiosity, does your new bottle smell like the tester at Holt Renfrew? IF it doesn't, seems like you could return it. Often, older bottle remain as testers, so it's really like false advertising IMHO. Actually, I think you should take it back and explain that something must have been altered because it does not smell like your older bottle. You could take the older bottle in with you, for back up, if you expect any arguments. This is a smaller firm and they should be able to give a proper explanation and know what's going on with their products, since, after all they don't have many. This is really expensive stuff!

Earlier this morning I emailed Tiphaine at Editions de Parfums about the possibility of reformulation to LPDT, and she seemed surprised by my inquiry. She says that the formula for Le Parfum de Therese remains the same.

It would be heartbreaking to tinker with such a beauty!

Chanel22, It's not so much a different jasmine as much as it smells like less jasmine.
Blackchat, I have emailed the Editions de Parfums company and am still waiting for a reply.
I hope this is not true and it's just a matter of the juice aging in the bottle (which is always something that needs to be taken into consideration when comparing different "vintages" - sometimes it's the same formulation but the juice has changed due to maturation).

Ayala, I guess we can only hope for the best which would be that your juice has changed a bit over time. This reformulation bussiness is not only frustrating but also sad. Perhaps Editions de Parfums will live up to its reputation as a maverick.

I sure hope so, Blackchat.
My only other explanation could be that since I haven't smelled Citta di Kyoto till recently and wasn't familiar with that kind of woody base before - that I am now picking up on it in the new Therese bottle.
It still smells like Therese from the top notes, but the dry down is not what I experience now and not what I remember from before. Our perceptions of scent do change though overtime when we are exposed to different things and both our experiences and tastes change.
I will let you know once I hear back from Editions de Parfums.

I bought my Therese when it was first release in the UK.

I always got the stewed plums notes(just like in Femme), and very soft smooth leather accord. Yes there is a cucumber water like note in there too very soft which gives a lightness to the fragrance.

I haven't smelled Therese yet, but I'm hoping and guessing that, as it's an old-ish formula, it probably contains a lot of naturals and that, as your new bottle is fresh (like a newborn) it will need a little time to settle.

Please let us know when you get a reply from them.

P.S Isn't Tiphaine a darling? I even feel guilty I haven't ordered anyhting for quite some time.

The cucumber like note is a melon note. I'm not sure which synthetic molecule is responsible for that, but it sure was ahead of its time! Diorella has a similar melon note, but it's far more floral and perfumey than Therese. The plum note smells more like an unripe plum to me - it could be the context though. In Femme the plum note is more like dried prunes. I just LOVE this perfume.

Ayala, thanks for bringing this up, and for all the detective work to track down whether a reformulation has occurred. I love this fragrance, too, and am eager to hear what happens...

C'est Nichist: I think it could be worn by a man, in the way that Diorella can be worn by a man. I tend to think of Eau Sauvage, Diorella, and Le Parfum de Thérèse as siblings (all children of Monsieur Roudnitska).

Yes, this is exactly my impression. The Femme I own is vintage. At different times of the year, the cucumber/melon or plum seem more prominant. This thread is making me concerned about other Frederic Malle fragrances. I wonder if anyone has noticed any changed in those? They aren't very generous with samples. I'd be devistated if anything happened to Iris Poudre, but there is always Ombre Rose as a fallback, I suppose.

Still not a word from Editions de Parfums. I'm just going to try to get used to my new bottle.
But keep in mind that we don't know that Therese was reformulated, it's just me who noticed it smells different and hopefully it's just because the juice in the old bottle have matured.
I wouldn't go as far as assuming the entire line is being reformulated. I really did not intend to create any panic of that nature with this thread; just wanted to hear if anyone else noticed a difference in Le Parfum de Therese or it's just my impression.

OMG her name is Tiphanie? Anybody who spells their name like this is lying.

I haven't emailed Tiphanie, I emailed contact@editionsdeparfums.com.
There are many ways to spell names though and I wouldn't go as far as making assumptions on someone's personality traits just because how their parents chose to spell their name.

I hadn't ever heard of Le Parfum de Therese until I encountered this thread, so I went on a search for reviews and descriptions. It sounds like a very balanced fruit and floral mix with a bit of a peppery bite.

Now Smell This had very kind words to say about it: "It is a lush, languid fragance, but it does not feel in the least heavy, in fact, it has a kind of clarity that is in stark contrast to Roudnitska's very early work, such as Rochas Femme. To my mind, it is the ultimate expression of his efforts to avoid complicated, muddled perfumes."

I wonder if Five-Oh has tried this yet -- she mentioned a few weeks ago her desire for a peppery aldehyde. This sounds like it might be right up her Canadian alley.

And on the subject of fruit and floral, I see that Jessica Simpson has released a perfume: Fancy. It's a (get ready for it) fruity-floral! -- "Fancy includes notes of pear, apricot nectar, red berries, night blooming jasmine, gardenia, toasted almonds, caramel, amber crystal, sandlewood and vanilla crème."

*sigh*

It's a good thing we have niche companies to rely on.

I sincerely hope Le Parfum de Therese hasn't been reformulated, as it sounds perfect just the way it is.

Posts containing personal attacks deleted.

Nathan, You're right, Therese would be perfect for 5-O. I think the only reason why 5-O doesn't like it (yet) is because it's not available in Montreal, and she prefers to buy in stores rather than online.

I thought Holt Renfrew carried these? Or is that only in the Vancouver store?

Nathan and Ayala, thanks for thinking of me! I have tested Parfum de Thérèse. A couple of years ago I tested all the Malles available at the time and in fact Thérèse was the only one I liked. You two have certainly got my number! At the same time, it was not a burning need for me. Although I appreciated it greatly, I didn't feel compelled to wear it.

One question I've always had about this perfume is I wondered if the melon note really was in the original Roudnitska formula or if it was added in modern times to update the scent, with melon being one of those trendy notes. When was Thérèse originally composed? Was melon a note used in perfumery at the time? How sure are we the melon was in the original?

Caz, I don't recall seeing these in Montreal but I think I heard something about them. Maybe it's newly in HR?

Tara,
I think Vancouver is the only place in Canada that has Editions de Parfums. And this is fairly new (just added last year when they re-opened with their new location).

At first I wasn't too impressed with Le Parfum de Thérèse and did not like that melon note too much. It wasn't until I wore it in very hot weather that I learned to appreciate it - I think it really shine in hot weather - dry or humid. And than it became a "burning need" for me...



I guess the only way to know for sure is ask the perfumer, who is no longer alive... His son might be the closest to the truth we can get to...
My guess is that the melon note was in the original formula though. It's also in Diorella, which has a similar (though far more floral) composition to Le Parfum de Thérèse. It is said to be composed in the 60's. Diorella was released in the early 70's. None of these were calone based melon notes as far as I can tell (which probably expalains why I can enjoy them).

As I mentioned on Saturday I emailed contact@editionsdeparfums.com. with my concerns as soon as I read this thread. Tiphaine, who is a dear, wrote me back quite nonplussed about my inquiry. She seems quite certain the formula remains the same. In my experience she has always been the main contact. Perhaps she/they are researching the matter further which might explain the delay in response to Ayala's email

Knowing I would sooner or later buy a full bottle of LPDT, ironically I've put it off to focus on aquiring things that are becoming extinct. I'm beginning to kick myself for having waited/

Ayala, Please keep us posted when you learn more!

I know nothing about the possible reformulation of Therese, but I want to second what Chanel22 wrote about receiving packages in the heat. I've been amazed at the differences in the way fragrances with synthetics smell when I first receive them vs. giving them a couple of days to settle and regain balance! I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you that your Therese just needs to acclimate. (Please know that I'm not trying to slam synthetic ingredients. In the last couple of weeks I've received quite a few samples of maintream, niche, and all-natural perfumes, and it's seemed to me that the natural perfumes didn't need a long cool-down period. Obviously there could be quirks in temperature, shipping methods, specific ingredients, etc. that contribute to this, so I may be completely off base.) I'm just hoping your Therese is all right!

So, I heard back from Audrey Tyran of the PR department of Editions de Parfums and I'm quoting from her email:

"Actually, Le Parfum de Thérèse has never been reformulated. It is very strange that your two bottles do not scent the same.
Would it be possible for you to go to a boutique with the fragrances to see if the difference do not come from a stocking problem?"

I will go and compare my bottle to the tester at Holt Renfrew and will report later today. It might just be the juice maturing overtime in the bottle. I doubt it's a stocking problem because all the perfumes are kept in the refrigerator over there.

Ayala, Thanks for the update. This sounds like good news. Please keep us posted!

Ooh, Ayala, I'm very impressed by that follow-up! They actually asked you to test the two versions at their counter to see if there was a problem? Excellent response! I look forward to hearing the outcome.

Well, I went to Holt Renfrew yesterday and tested their tester. It does smell like my old bottle. I do a side-by-side comparison but will do one to confirm next time - I'll bring my little purse atomizer and see what the SAs think about it. I just didn't have enough time yesterday to do more than just spraying myself from the tester.
My guess is that this particular juice needs to mature in order to become what I remembered it to be. It is kept refrigerated over there but the testers aren't. I don't know when it will change that way but I hope it does soon!

The final word I've got on Therese, is directly from the source (Michel Roudniska) and is the most relieving: Now, Le Parfum de Therese has not been reformulated since it was launched and those differences I've mentioned (between my old bottle and the new bottle) are due to maturation. The perfume has changed and aged in time so I will just wait and see when it gets to that point and until than enjoy the "fresh" juice and it's more pronounced woodiness.

Ayala, thanks for the final word from the source! Perfumes that have a maturing curve like this one are my reason for backup! There are a few perfumes I feel do better after some time such as Chanel No 5 in the parfum and at Claude André Hébert, though they swear up and down the scents are matured, I have noticed a more rounded, unified note after several weeks. Enjoy the PdT in the best of health!

Ayala, Many thanks for keeping us up to date! I'm so releived to know that LPDT indeed remains its same beautiful self! Thank you for all your hard work and research in the matter. It's impressive that Michel Roudniska took the time to get in touch with you.

It sounds like the refridgerator is set too cold. I have read that if perfume is kept in too cold a temperature, it can be damaged just as much as at a too warm temperature.